Storybearers - Week 2

0:01 · Speaker 1 So, I'll surely invite Corrie up to be our next story bearer in our series. And the passage that she has chosen, as the way I described it last week, that sort of golden thread that is weaved into her story, is thankfully another short one from my perspective, as I try and teach in a few minutes. But it's also, as I was reflecting on it, it's a really wonderful bridge between Neil and Sharon's story last week and Corrie's story this week. It's from 2 Corinthians 4, and it's just those short verses, verses 16 to 18. Here's what Paul says to the church in Corinth in those verses. Therefore, we do not lose heart. Though outwardly we are wasting away, yet inwardly we are being renewed day by day. For our light and momentary troubles are achieving for us an eternal glory that far outweighs them all.

1:02 · Speaker 1 So we fix our eyes not on what is seen, but on what is unseen, since what is seen is temporary, but what is unseen is eternal. Now you know me, that I would love nothing more than to spend the next 15-20 minutes giving you all the context for these verses so you don't take them out of context. I would love to tell you how this letter connects with 1 Corinthians. I'd love to tell you how this passage connects with what Phil Knox was talking about recently in the verses just above about we have these treasures in jars of clay, but I need to give Corrie time to speak this morning, so I'm not going to be able to do much of that. For now then, suffice to say, Paul is writing to this church in Corinth, a city all about success and prosperity and wealth. And the church there sees all the suffering that Paul has endured. All his troubles, all his afflictions. This is a church that sees all his weakness, all those troubles, all that suffering.

2:06 · Speaker 1 and based on what they see, they have concluded, many of them, they have made the assessment that his life and his ministry are some sort of failure, that because of that, he could not be a true apostle. And they were really questioning, how can God be with somebody that has been as weak and failing as they. And in this chapter then, Paul is explaining to them why in the midst of all his suffering and all his troubles and his weakness and his apparent failure in their eyes, he does not lose heart as some of them think that he should. But instead he is full of hope because, and he explains this to them in the verses that precede these, this is the shape of the gospel that follows Jesus. Suffering, then glory. Weakness, then power. Death, then life. The cross, then resurrection.

3:14 · Speaker 1 It is not out of kilter with the life of Jesus and the gospel of Jesus for Paul to suffer. And in these verses in particular, he's telling them he does not lose heart because he is looking at totally different things than they are. He is looking at his life, he's looking at his ministry, he's looking at his circumstances from a completely different vantage point as we mentioned at the beginning and as we've been singing about since, and the right perspective changes everything. Your evaluation of my life, Paul says, is based on what you see. And so many of us are so good at evaluating our own lives and the lives of others based on what we see. But Paul says, I fix my eyes on what is unseen and I base my evaluation on that and that changes how I see everything in life, including my troubles and the afflictions that I've suffered. So what does he mean by unseen? I was struck last week by something that Neil said in our conversation.

4:31 · Speaker 1 A very honest thing he said about how his mind naturally works. And I think something very reflective of many of the ways that our minds work. He said this, for me to cope, I go with the worst case scenario and then work my way back. You might remember him describing himself Googling, how he was looking up all the worst case scenarios. Fix your eyes on the worst case scenario and anything less than that is a bonus, is basically what he was saying. And I totally get where he's coming from there. But what Paul is describing here, and what Paul's advocating for us as an example to follow, in terms of all of our life, in terms of our values, in terms of what we think about as important, what we think about in terms of our purpose, and all those things, but especially when it comes to our struggles and our suffering, is a very different approach to that. He is saying that he has disciplined his mind to go not to the worst case scenario, but to the best case scenario and work his way back from there.

5:42 · Speaker 1 And of course, the thing about Paul's best case scenario is this, it is not just one of a number of possible scenarios, it is a certain hope. He's made that clear already in verses 13 and 14 when he says, since we have that same spirit of faith, we also believe and therefore speak because we know that the one who raised the Lord Jesus from the dead will also raise us with Jesus and present us with you to himself. I always, Paul says here, work my way back from the best case scenario, certain hope of eternal resurrection life with Christ guaranteed by the gift of his spirit, as he goes on to say later in this chapter. When you fix your eyes there, he says, not on the transient, but on the eternal, your perspective on your outward wasting away is transformed. You're not, in the words of of Romans 12, conformed to the pattern of thinking of this world. Yes, you can be honest about your outward wasting away. Some of us are really good at that, and that's okay. You can be real about it.

7:00 · Speaker 1 You can be honest about it, about how it leads to groaning and how it leads to burden and how it leads to struggle. Paul's honest about it in chapter five, but you know and see this, he's saying, that the promised resurrection body has been paid for and guaranteed on your behalf. And that changes things. And what's more, he says, you can rejoice in the new life that is going on within you, in the unseen, eternal, inner being renewal that the Holy Spirit is working in you as he prepares your character for that consummation of that best case scenario, resurrection in Christ. There is new life happening. It's unseen to the naked eye, but it's just as true and even more eternal. And when you fix your eyes there, he says, on that best case scenario, certain hope, this is where your perspective on your struggles and your suffering is transformed as well. You're not conformed to the pattern of thinking of this world.

8:13 · Speaker 1 and let's be clear here again, we are not talking about some sort of stiff upper lip, stoic approach, acceptance of our suffering. That's not what Paul is talking about here. As we said last week, God's word makes room for, and God's word encourages honest lament, and sorrow, and grief. I said, think about the psalmists last week. Think about Jesus at the tomb of Lazarus, think about him in the garden. And we need to make sure that we make room for each other and with each other to do that too. And that's part of why we're doing this series, to fight back against the tendency that can happen in church at times, where we feel if we can't say everything's all right, then we can't say anything at all.

9:14 · Speaker 1 And that's not what this is about here. That's not what Paul is saying. In chapter one, he honestly describes how the suffering he went through in Asia, listen to his words, they made him despair of life itself. And he felt like we'd received a sentence of death. And the danger of course when we read these words in verses 16 to 18, and we hear him say light and momentary, we might think that he is somehow minimizing his suffering, our suffering. But he's not doing that. He is saying, when I fix my eyes on the eternal best case scenario, when I start there and work my way back from that certain hope resurrection body, that new heavens and new earth that is mine in Christ through his death and through his resurrection and the sheer glory of what that will be and the sheer glory of who I will be in that eternity.

10:15 · Speaker 1 And I set that on one side of the balancing scales. And then I set my struggles and my suffering on the other. When you weigh them up, the only way I can describe them, he says, is light and momentary. Even those ones where he said he felt like he was under a sentence of death. But it's even more than that. It's even more than that. It's not just that the certain hope of eternity outweighs. It's not just that it somehow compensates for our present struggles and suffering.

10:57 · Speaker 1 It's that somehow God will use it all in achieving that eternal weight of glory beyond all comparison. That somehow he will redeem our suffering and weave it into the glory and into the beauty he molds and refines and achieves in us. That none of it, none of what you've gone through before, none of what you're going through today, none of what you're going to go through in the future will be wasted, will be pointless, will be for nothing. I'm always stunned

11:48 · Speaker 1 by the fact that Jesus' scars of his suffering are part of his eternal resurrection body of glory. that they weren't taken away, that they became part of his glory forever. And in his love and his grace, God will redeem all of our scars of our suffering and the glory and beauty that he achieves in us. C.S. Lewis reflects on this in The Great Divorce. He says this, "Some mortals say of temporal suffering, "no future bliss can make up for it." Not knowing that heaven, I'd love him to say that the new heavens and the new earth, once attained, will work backwards and turn even that agony into glory.

12:42 · Speaker 1 Heaven, once attained, will work backwards and turn even that agony into a glory. And just before I invite Corey up, let me finish with another C.S. Lewis quote. and I'm finishing with this because back in 2020 when we were doing our rooted series of devotionals when we were all socially distanced, Corrie actually did one of those on this passage and she finished with this quote. So I thought it would be a good thing to finish with. These are the closing words of Lewis's Narnia series from The Last Battle. And this is what is said at the end of the story. But the things that began to happen after that were so great and beautiful that I cannot write them.

13:28 · Speaker 1 And for us, this is the end of all the stories. And we can most truly say that they all lived happily ever after. But for them, it was only the beginning of the real story. All their life in this world and all their adventures in Narnia had only been the cover and the title page. Now at last, they were beginning chapter one of the great story which no one on earth has read, which goes on forever, in which every chapter is better than the one before. Therefore, we do not lose heart. Though outwardly we are wasting away, yet inwardly we are being renewed day by day. For our light and momentary troubles are achieving for us an eternal glory that far outweighs them all.

14:19 · Speaker 1 So we fix our eyes not on what is seen, but on what is unseen, since what is seen is temporary, but what is unseen is eternal. Corey, why don't you, Jeremy, remember to put this out of the way this week. Why don't you give her a little yes round of applause as she comes up. Grab a seat. No, no, it's okay. Right, let me find what I'm looking for here. Well, listen, again, as I said to Neil and Sharon last week, thank you first and foremost for agreeing to do this, because I know what a big deal it is to come up here and to tell your story. So I do really appreciate that.

15:05 · Speaker 1 Why don't you begin? A lot of people here will know you from standing behind these mics up here, not in this sort of circumstance. But why don't you for people who don't know you just introduce yourself briefly to me?

15:14 · Speaker 2 Yeah. So, yes, it's a very whole different ballgame back there. This is much more nerve-wracking. I'm Corey and married to Stevie, maybe known better as Stevie's wife around here. And I am a mum to two little boys. I think soon I'm going to just be known as Owen's mum, probably. Owen is two and a half, three in August, and then Liam will be one in a couple of weeks. And we also have a baby on the way, so number three coming in July.

15:46 · Speaker 2 So we are very busy. Yes, three under three. And I am a teacher by training. I taught for a few years. And then since coming over here, I've been working for Libraries NI at the Public Library in Port Glenone. So I'm a librarian now, I can say. And I have been at Glen Abbey since 2017. I joined in 2018.

16:12 · Speaker 2 And we are part of the Claddy Water Home Group. We love, love, love our home group. and a bunch of them are here today. So this is a, like Neil and Sharon, big plug for home groups. That is our massive support group and we're so thankful for them. And then I've also, lately since having my kids, I've really enjoyed the Friday morning Mums Bible study. So a big thanks to Rebecca and Noreen who run that for us every week.

16:40 · Speaker 1 Brilliant. People will be hearing your accent and realize you're not from Glyn Gormley. You're not from Ballyclare. Although I've got to say, I was listening to your rooted thing from 2020. Have I gotten worse? I'm hearing a little bit more Northern Ireland in there than I did in 2020. You can come back to the 25. But why don't you tell us, obviously you're not from here, why don't you tell us a little bit about where you're from growing up briefly, that sort of thing, just to set the scene for us.

17:03 · Speaker 2 I think it's bad if even Northern Irish people are starting to notice. All my American friends say I've lost my accent. But I grew up in Virginia on the east coast of the States. And my dad always worked for the government throughout my childhood. So we always lived in and around D.C., the Washington, D.C. area. And grew up in a Christian home. Youngest of four children.

17:28 · Speaker 2 I have a sister, Katie, and then brother, Joe, and then sister, Annie. And then there's me. And like when I say it was a Christian home, it was a really, really Christian home. My parents have always been very faithful believers. And they made their faith, it was the center of their personal lives, the center of each of their lives individually and of their marriage. And then also of our upbringing and our life as a family. So we were hugely involved in our church. We were there every Sunday morning and evening, whether we wanted to be or not as kids.

18:05 · Speaker 2 We were at church even on holiday. My dad was an elder. My mom was really involved in Bible study. So just, I think the thing I really think of throughout childhood is just seeing them every morning somewhere in the house doing their separate quiet times. They were very faithful about personal devotion and set such a good example for us as we were growing up. And then skipping to adulthood, I then moved here in September, 2017. So coming up on eight years in Northern Ireland.

18:38 · Speaker 1 And we're going to hear more of that. Yes, we'll save that for later. So you've mentioned family there. you've mentioned your sisters and your brother at the heart of your story we can't really tell your story before we tell Joe's story first because they all connect up so why don't you tell us about your brother and give us some insight into him and what happened with him

18:58 · Speaker 2 I would love to I think we sort of said in our conversation that like Neil and Sharon this is kind of a story of two parts so part one is really more not my story but my brother's story Joe Um, and he, uh, he's six years older than me, um, and was a really lovely, sweet child, very sensitive. Um, he was, um, very kind to me when I was a baby. My parents always tell this story about coming in one day and seeing him sitting there crying when I was a baby and they said, Oh, what's wrong? And he said, Oh, she's just so cute. So it was just very, very sweet. really loved to cuddle me and hold me and everything. But he was also a boy surrounded by three girls. So, you know, like I can remember throughout childhood, he just got in trouble for like, be more gentle, don't be so boisterous.

19:55 · Speaker 2 But really just a good child. And he came to faith at an early age. We all made early professions of faith as children. And then as he moved into his teenage years and into college, I'm just going to say college, which is what we say in America, but you can take that to mean university. Yes, uni, whatever. As he moved into high school and then college, he was always very athletic and very good at sports. And so those were kind of his friend groups. And he didn't really have any Christian friends.

20:29 · Speaker 2 And he just sort of like wandered a bit from his faith. I would say that his faith was still very much there, but it was like on the back burner for him. And, you know, if you compare it to sort of worldly standards, I don't think you could say he did anything really radical or off the rails, but he very much was not pursuing Jesus at that time. And in part because he really didn't have a community of friends around him that were interested in that either, you know. But for a lot of reasons, it was sort of like a nagging thing at the back of his mind, maybe, that he thought about every now and then, but it certainly was not his first priority. And especially, he went away to a really big college, and my parents tried to encourage him to join Christian Fellowship and things like that, but he just, he wasn't really interested, or the timing wasn't right, or he just, there was always kind of reasons, and he was always like, well, yeah, maybe next semester. So a bit of time of wandering and that kind of affected his whole manner, like that really sweet child that he had been was kind of hidden now under this more tough guy exterior of like, I'm an athlete and I don't, you know, so his relationship with us just was a little bit tricky at that time. At the end of college, he was in a really serious relationship with a girl who wasn't a Christian, and he was really serious about her, and he was trying to get a job that he really wanted.

22:08 · Speaker 2 And then right back to back, she broke up with him. Um, and he didn't get the job that he was really hoping to step into after college. And, um, the breakup was really like God's kindness to him because he wasn't going to break up with her. Um, and she didn't, she wasn't a believer at all, but the job loss also both of those things together just put him in a really rough state of mind. And, and, uh, he came home then to our house in Virginia after graduating and was really low and kind of really pretty depressed and kind of directionless. And at that time, the things he had learned as a child, and of course the Holy Spirit also working in him, drew him back to, so he had that upbringing and he had those truths that were really planted in him. And those were the things that came out then And for him, as he felt really directionless, he started to think about his faith a bit more. And he asked my dad, he just said, I need something just to do to get me out of the house every day.

23:18 · Speaker 2 I just, I don't know what I'm going to do for work, but I just need something. So my dad organized an internship for him with a congressman in D.C., and it was a Christian congressman. And all of his co-workers were Christians. So that environment that he hadn't had in high school and college now, suddenly he had. And he then, he loved the job and he ended up getting hired to work in the office full time. And he joined this group on Capitol Hill called Faith and Law, which is like a network for Christians working in the government. And he said to my dad, I've just joined this group. It's really cool.

23:55 · Speaker 2 It's been very encouraging. And my dad said, I started that group several decades ago. And he had no idea. So, I mean, amazing the way the Lord was like laying that foundation. So he joined that group. He joined his own church. So he was really starting to take ownership over his faith. That is kind of like laying the groundwork then for.

24:17 · Speaker 1 For what comes next. Yes. And whenever you were telling this story to me, again, it had echoes of, I suppose, Neil and Sharon last week in terms of, they thought they were going through this critical period of time. Yeah. That God was teaching them and waiting to come out the other side, perhaps. But that's not necessarily the way things work.

24:34 · Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah. And I think he thought those like, okay, I've just been through the hardest things. A breakup can feel really awful and a loss of a job can feel really awful. And I think he thought, I've never been tested like this before. And that was really like a training ground for what was to come. So then December of that year after he graduated, that was kind of all happening in the fall. September 2010, I at this point was away in my first year of college. I came home for Christmas break and we were all together and I can remember him just really saying like, you know, I've had this cold sore in my tongue for a couple months and it's really annoying.

25:14 · Speaker 2 I don't know why it's not going away. And my parents were saying, you should probably get that looked at because it's been there for a few months, you know. So he ended up going to the doctor and then in February of 2011, The doctor then told him from the scans they had done that this was a cancerous tumor that would need to be removed. So I want to just walk you through now the sort of the timeline then of that kind of that's the start of the really big, the big trial. So this was going to be quite a tricky surgery because they were going to have to remove a big portion of his tongue and then repair it with other skin from other parts of his body. and he would have to likely, he wasn't sure what the effects would be. Would he be able to speak? What would, you know, would he need lots of physio to recover the use of his tongue?

26:05 · Speaker 2 But he was not phased. He was like, I know the promises of Jesus. And he, because he had been already going through that kind of a training, he was just like, let's do it. It's going to be okay. We'll take it as it comes. So he had the surgery in the winter and seemed to be great. Seemingly they had removed all the cancer they could see in his tongue. And he was able to talk and he relearned.

26:33 · Speaker 2 He spoke differently, but he relearned how to talk and that was all great. Then summer rolled around and there, he was uncomfortable again. And it was discovered that they had either hadn't got it all or it had come back and there was more. So they went in to do the surgery again. And as they were, it was kind of an exploratory surgery, but as they were in there working, they realized this has spread really across his whole tongue. And like, this would be devastating surgery if we continued. So we really need to pursue chemo and radiation at this point. So he came out of surgery and they said, like, we haven't really done anything today.

27:18 · Speaker 2 and we think you need to do chemo and radiation instead. So we then, my parents took him up to Chicago to have his treatment there because that was one of the foremost hospitals in head and neck cancer. So they moved up there for, they went back and forth across the autumn 2011 for his treatment, and it was a really aggressive treatment that he underwent there and really grueling on his body. He had to take a really strong pain medication and things like that. But at the end of that whole process, by the winter of 2012, from the scans they were doing, they were saying, there's no cancer that we can see. So they weren't really using the word in remission, but they were just saying, we've gotten everything here that we can see. So it seems to be gone. So at this point then, he enrolled in law school in South Carolina, and he moved down to Columbia and joined Sinclair Ferguson's church down there.

28:21 · Speaker 2 And he really threw himself into this. He felt like this new lease of life and he wanted to pursue law and he wanted to sort of. He said to my parents, like, I'm doing my master's degree now and I want to have a different experience than what I had in college. I want to be part of church. I want to be part of all the any Christian organization I can be part of. I want to be part of. So he was actually going to two churches every Sunday. He was going to his own church.

28:49 · Speaker 2 And then he was going to my sister. My sister lives in South Carolina. So he was going to her church as well.

28:53 · Speaker 1 Just back to childhood again.

28:54 · Speaker 2 Yes. That was what he knew. That's what he was familiar with. And we that summer 2012, we had a really wonderful family vacation. Everything seemed really good. Then in September of 2012, he said to my parents, I've been having a lot of pain in my legs. And I don't know what it is. so I'm going to just go and get it checked out.

29:17 · Speaker 2 And the scans at that time then showed the cancer had returned, and now it was in both legs, the bones of his legs, and also in his lungs, and really just everywhere. So the treatment plan in South Carolina was much more about trying to shrink the tumors to help him maintain his way of life and really pain management. He really didn't want to go back on the heavy painkillers because it had taken him a long time to go off of them. And he wanted his mind to be clear because he was so enjoying studying and he was so enjoying learning about God's word and being part of his church. So he was pretty adamant that he wanted to find other pain management solutions. So there wasn't really any talk at this point about the future. It was very much just let's try and see if we can shrink what's here, and then we'll go from there. But he was able to go in and out of hospital for his treatment, so he was still doing his law degree somehow in the middle of all of this.

30:25 · Speaker 2 And he joined a Bible study at his church, which happened to be led by an assistant pastor who's from Northern Ireland of all places. His name is Mark McDowell, in case anybody in the room knows him, because it's such a small world here. And they formed a really close, supportive relationship. And they were studying Kevin DeYoung's book, The Hole in Our Holiness, which I just love that he was like going through this physical deterioration and challenge. And like his main concern was his holiness.

30:57 · Speaker 1 So outward wifting away.

30:59 · Speaker 2 Yes, absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. Instead of saying, you know, I'm really tired. I can't be bothered with this. Or like, I might die. I might see Jesus soon. He was like, no, it's not enough.

31:12 · Speaker 2 More and more and more of Jesus. I want to be more like Jesus. While I'm here, I want to make use of the time that I have. So yes, that's amazing to me. Thanksgiving then, 2012, we all came down to South Carolina to be with him in his hospital room. and I really just will always carry this image of him in his hospital room with me. He was in his bed there and he, at this point, he was in the hospital more than he was out of it. So he was really just staying in his hospital room, not going home.

31:48 · Speaker 2 And he was like half the size that he had been. He was in constant pain, you know, like audibly really groaning with the misery of how painful it was. and could barely keep his eyes open. He was drifting in and out of sleep constantly, but he had always had his Bible just open on his lap. And those things I've mentioned, those are really traumatic things to remember about your brother, but by the Lord's grace, I think the thing that I really think of all the time is that image of him with the Bible open, and I don't hear the groaning or the things like that. I just hear the stuff he was saying about God's word and about how much he loved Jesus. And like he was saying to each of us individually, I admire you so much. I'm so proud of you.

32:40 · Speaker 2 You take your faith so seriously. I wish I had been like you when I was your age. It's like he had a little word for each of us. And he could barely get this stuff out, but he would fall asleep. And then he would wake up again and he would say various things. So that is kind of like the image I have of him, just Jesus, just pouring, pouring out of him. I went home then after Thanksgiving, home, being back to college to do, to prepare for my exams. And you know, like when I describe that to you, you're probably thinking that guy is about to die.

33:20 · Speaker 2 But I still just was like, at the 11th hour, something's going to happen, you know. God will heal him. People we know in our family don't die like that. And I think I just didn't think about it. I was just like, no, my brother won't die. Something will happen here. Um, so, which is how we cope, I suppose. But yeah.

33:45 · Speaker 2 Um, so I went, I went home and I was, um, studying for exams. And then a few days after I got back home, I got an email from him and he didn't say much in the email, just said, this is a great song. You should share it around your college campus. And it was a song from a group that I didn't really know anything about at the time. They weren't very big of a deal at this time. The only thing I knew about them was that they had written this song in Christ alone that we sang a lot in church. Uh, didn't know who they were or anything, but the song was speak Oh Lord. Um, and I, I think it's amazing to me that, that he, that's the song he was listening to in his bed with his Bible open.

34:34 · Speaker 2 And he was like, I've written the words down here of verse one and two, just that he was coming to the word of God and saying, speak Oh Lord, as we come to you to receive the food of your Holy word, Take your truth and plant it deep in me. Shape and fashion me in your likeness. That the light of Christ might be seen today in my acts of love and deeds of faith. Speak, O Lord, and fulfill in me all your purposes for your glory. And then like verse 2 is teach us obedience, humility, reverence. Test us in the radiance of your purity. Cause our faith to rise. Cause our eyes to see your majestic love and authority.

35:11 · Speaker 2 That's the prayer that he had as he came to God's word. And that's what he cared about. The closer and closer he got to seeing Christ face to face. So he sent me that email. And again, because I was in denial, I was like, that's nice. But I didn't really think much about it. But it was a week after that that I was in my student union. And I was with my friends studying.

35:37 · Speaker 2 And I got a call from my dad, which was very unusual. My dad never calls me, only my mom. And I took the call and he said, I think you need to get on a flight and come home right now. So I flew right home and miraculously my sisters, they all flew home and we all landed in the airport at the same time. And my dad took us out to the sidewalk at the drop-off zone, the pickup zone and just put his arms around all of us at one time and just said he didn't make it

36:14 · Speaker 1 sorry it's okay um yeah you can you can see why we wanted i wanted you to hear this story but i suppose it's an amazing story and an amazing witness and testimony um if linking it with the passage that I've just talked from. What did Joe, what did his example, how did it both proclaim and live out the truth of the example of what Paul's talking about there, I suppose for you, as you sort of reflect on it. Yeah,

36:53 · Speaker 2 I mean, I think that that line, therefore we do not lose heart, you couldn't have said something more true about him. He really did not lose heart in the middle of this whole battle. his heart and spirit and soul were just strengthened and strengthened and strengthened. And he just, that idea of like outwardly we're wasting away, again, you couldn't have a better picture of that. He was literally wasting away in front of us, but inwardly he was more and more like Christ and just became such a beautiful person. The closer he got to Jesus, the more he was just like Jesus, which is just amazing. Um,

37:34 · Speaker 1 that inward renewal was so real.

37:36 · Speaker 2 Yeah.

37:37 · Speaker 1 Yeah. And it's not often that you really get to see that. Yeah.

37:40 · Speaker 2 You really get to see that. Um, and our, so his minister, his pastor friend, Mark McDowell spoke at his funeral and he coined this phrase that's become like our family motto, which is, he said, Joe knew how to live lightly. Um, and I think that really ties in with that idea of the eternal weight of glory, the weight of glory, the lightness of the things of this world. The fact that he pursued his law degree and joined, threw himself into his church. And like, he also was planning a holiday for the summer to the UK and looking forward to that. He had all of these things that he was doing, investing in this world, But he held them really loosely with the idea that these are good things. The church is a wonderful thing. I want to keep reading God's word.

38:29 · Speaker 2 I want to travel and see more of his world if I'm here. But if I'm not, even better. And he didn't have any fear about that or any feeling of like, I'm not ready to die yet. I just need to do a bit more. But he was only 26. So he could have been saying, like, I've barely done anything yet. But he was just like, well, if I'm here, great. And if I'm not, even better.

38:55 · Speaker 2 And he really had the eyes fixed on that eternal weight that was coming, you know, and the things that really matter. So he, I am.

39:06 · Speaker 1 You've got a picture.

39:07 · Speaker 2 Yes, he had these. I have a picture of these. He asked my cousin to make these posters for him that he could put them up in his hospital room. And so this just gives you a picture of the scriptures that were really on his heart and his mind. He just was asking the Lord to bless this situation. And, you know, yeah, this was like his focus of, I hope that this is what people will see. And he wanted everyone coming into his room, his hospital room, to know this is what I'm living for and striving towards.

39:46 · Speaker 1 Brilliant. Listen, I really appreciate you sharing that. part of the story and his story and I know then from that probably each and every family member has their own story to tell coming out of that where I suppose I just want you to tell yours so coming from the pain and the grief of losing a brother of 26 you're what 20 at the time I was 20 yeah maybe tell us in the time we have left then just a little bit Trying to tell that part faster. No, it's okay. I don't think so. I don't think anybody here am I.

40:18 · Speaker 2 So changing directions, I feel like that's the first section. And then this story is almost like a love story in some ways. But so, yes, I was 20 at the time. And this is sort of just bringing it back to what was going on with me. I was finishing up my teacher training and he died in the middle of my third year. So I had one more year to go. And I just decided that summer that I'd love to study abroad, like in part because he had been planning his trip and didn't get to go. And I thought, well, I am here and I can go.

40:59 · Speaker 2 So why don't I study abroad? And I like all good Americans. I just wanted to go to an English speaking place. because I can't speak another language. So I sort of was like, what about Ireland? Because again, like Americans, we have like loose ties to Irish heritage and we all love Ireland. So I studied abroad in Galway that summer and spent the summer there. And like I came home feeling like it was really fun and it was really great.

41:38 · Speaker 2 But also like this feeling of I'm not done there. There's something still there that God has for me. And I don't know what it is. And everybody around me was like, oh, it's just study abroad. That's how you feel. You just come back and you're like, I want to live there forever. But I was like, no, you guys don't get it. I really feel, I feel a weird thing like that I am going to go back there.

42:03 · Speaker 2 But I don't know. I don't know. what that will look like. And, you know, at the same time, we were dealing with the loss of Joe still, you know, and so real life was much more distracting than that. So that was kind of just like on the back burner. Yeah.

42:21 · Speaker 1 Your parents, I suppose then the idea of going to them and saying,

42:25 · Speaker 2 yes, I didn't want to go and say like, can I move? Yeah. I'll come back to that. Cause then I did eventually talk to them about it and they were wonderful. But, um, so I graduated and I moved back to Virginia. I started teaching. I taught for three years. I had a really wonderful housemate situation.

42:42 · Speaker 2 I loved my housemates. I threw myself into my church and loved my church. Um, and there really was nothing that I could say, like, there's something wrong here or there's something I want to change. Everything was wonderful. I loved my job. It was all just a great time, but I still had this weird restlessness that this wasn't it. Not like this isn't enough, but like this isn't what I'm supposed to be doing. And I don't know why or what that, I was like, I think I was good at teaching.

43:13 · Speaker 2 It wasn't like this is a bad fit for me or anything. I just had this weird niggling kind of a feeling. Um, so unusual for me, cause I like to plan and I'm a planner. I decided I'm just going to pray about this every night for a year and I'm going to leave it with God and try to be patient and listen to the Holy Spirit, which is not something that comes easily to me at all. So I prayed every night, Lord, I don't know what this desire is. I don't know what this feeling is. And if it's not from you, could you just change it? Because it's actually really annoying and it's intruding on the good life that you've given me.

43:51 · Speaker 2 And if it is from you, then can you show me what it's about or, you know, make it clear to me what I'm supposed to be doing here. So I did that every night for a year. And at the end of that year, I have to say, it's not like, it's not like God wrote with a finger on the wall. There wasn't like a big, this is what you should do.

44:09 · Speaker 1 But yes, exactly.

44:11 · Speaker 2 But I did feel, well, I've done this now for a year and it hasn't changed. I still want to go. So I asked him to change it and he didn't. So maybe that's the answer, But he's still expecting me to do a bit of the work here and figure out how to make this happen. I've always loved creative writing. And that's been something that I love even more than teaching. So I thought, like, maybe I could go and just study for a year and get my master's in creative writing and see what comes from that. So, yes, that was the point then when I went to my parents and I said, I'm thinking about doing this.

44:47 · Speaker 2 It's only for a year. What do you think? And I did expect them to say, that's like really romantic and foolish. You have a great situation here. Motivated in part because they had just lost a child. And why would you want to see another child move halfway across the world? But they said, if that's the feeling that you have, that's obviously the Lord calling you. And you need to go.

45:14 · Speaker 2 And you need to follow it.

45:17 · Speaker 1 Like a great generosity of spirit on their behalf.

45:19 · Speaker 2 Really open-handed, like Hannah in the temple, just, Lord, these are your children. They're not our children. You gave them to us, and you will take them, whichever and wherever. So, yeah. Yeah.

45:34 · Speaker 1 You have probably a different perspective in that now with two of your own, do you? Yeah.

45:38 · Speaker 2 I think about that a lot. Yeah. Yeah. I don't even know how they did that. And they only thought it was for a year. They didn't even know. So meanwhile, I think that the beauty of this story is that that's all quite step by step. But God was also doing a lot of things around our whole family at this time, bringing lots of different people from Northern Ireland into our lives as well, which is odd because you're not a very big place.

46:04 · Speaker 2 And there aren't that many of you in America. And we seem to know all of you in America.

46:09 · Speaker 1 But we punch well above our way. Yes.

46:12 · Speaker 2 You make a big impact. So like we would go up to Maine every summer and our pastor of the church that we went to up there is from Ballyclare and his wife is from Belfast. You know, how how small is the world? And then the big the big deal thing is that at the same time that I was having that kind of a personal journey, my parents decided right after Joe passed away to go to the Getty's concert because they were touring at the time. And because this song had meant so much to him. So they went to the concert. And at that time, the Gettys were not the way they are now, as in they weren't so big. They're a huge deal now.

46:56 · Speaker 2 So it was a much more intimate kind of a... It was just in a small church. And Keith was out in the lobby afterwards. And my dad made a point to go over and say how this song had impacted our family. And we'd had it at my brother's funeral and everything. If you remember, I'm talking about the email he sent me, because I know it's been a while since I mentioned that. So, yes, so he told this to Keith. And I think the amazing thing is that they must hear stories like that all the time, because thousands upon thousands of people have been impacted by their music.

47:28 · Speaker 2 But for whatever reason, it really struck his heart that day. And he was in, Keith was in tears. And the two of them were hugging and whatever. this turned into this really, really close friendship that nobody would have predicted because my dad's son loved this song and they became really close. And then, so they then spoke into my desire to come back to this island and they said, you should really consider Northern Ireland because, you know, you'll find a larger Christian community and it might be easier for you settling. And, you know, they're just biased towards Northern Ireland. So they kind of, like said, really encouraged me to look at Queens and to look at Belfast instead of other things I was looking at. And then through them, I then met Gilbert at one of their concerts the Christmas before I moved over here.

48:23 · Speaker 2 And Gilbert said, he and Kristen were saying, you know, that we have a church that you should attend when you're there. So they were sort of setting me up to come to Glen Abbey. So I did then, skipping ahead, I did then move here. I followed the, I moved here for the program for the Masters. And I moved here in September 2017. Couldn't get to Glen Abbey because I had no car. So I was like, no, I'll just not bother. But the very week that I moved here, my dad met you.

48:55 · Speaker 1 That's the important part of the story. Yes.

48:59 · Speaker 2 When Chris appears, my dad in Nashville met you. And he said, my daughter just moved. Well, you can share what he said. I don't know. I wasn't there.

49:09 · Speaker 1 And he was really keen for you to go to a good church. And would Glen Abbey work? But I think he just said, yeah, you couldn't get there. So we had young adults at the time. And I got a couple of those guys to go over to the other side of town and pick you up in their kindness. And I think it took it from there. I really didn't do very much.

49:27 · Speaker 2 Yeah. Well, that was really important. So, yes, you connected me to the lift, to church. And from then on, then I started coming and Alison, she's now Alison Adams. She gave me a lift every single Sunday. It wasn't on her way at all. And she just did that out of the goodness of her heart. But again, like, so that was great.

49:46 · Speaker 2 But I was sort of like, okay, God, I'm here. I'm doing the program. I've got a church. What is the point? Why did you, why did you do all of this? And, and then it was in January. Then after I moved over here that I will never forget. I was riding with Hannah Besant.

50:02 · Speaker 2 and I said there's a lot of there's a lot of people in Glen Abbey called Stephen have you noticed that and then she said something like oh yeah like Stephen Lennox Stephen Besant and Stephen Johnston and I was like I don't know who that is she said oh you haven't met Stevie and I said no no I've met all those other ones but I've never met him and then after church that Sunday she was thrilled to be like look this is Stevie the one I was telling you about and seven months later we were engaged and then seven months after that we were married didn't take long no did not take long and I think the really like weird full circle moment was whenever my dad was like who's this guy she's dating I'm gonna ask Keith has he ever heard of this person and Keith said oh Stevie Johnston I know him I know well he's a great guy and he said if I had four Stevies for my four daughters, I would be set. So that was all my dad needed to hear. So yes,

50:59 · Speaker 1 that is the full circle

51:02 · Speaker 2 of how God brought me over here from a song that my brother emailed to me the week before he died. Brilliant.

51:12 · Speaker 1 Listen, we've got a couple more minutes. Give me, listen, it's been great to hear your story. So give me a couple of reflections in terms of, we talked about last week with Neil and Sharon, what difference to our life, to our mindset, to, in all of these circumstances, does a faith in Jesus make, does his spirit make, and you've described so much of that already, but maybe a couple of other reflections on top of that as well would be really good just to finish.

51:39 · Speaker 2 Yeah. And I think you've kind of covered in your talk, some of the things that really stuck out to me already. So I don't want to retread the same ground, but just, you know, the faith in Jesus and trusting in the promises of his word, for me and for our family, we really believed and we really saw that though we were praying for the healing of my brother's body, his soul was healed in a much bigger way. And that that is actually better when you believe in Jesus, you can say that fully. And that his death, nothing is wasted. You've said this already, but nothing is wasted in God's story, even death. And that's like a really common thing for people to say when someone young dies. It's like, what a waste of a life.

52:27 · Speaker 2 But that was not a waste of a life. And as you've said, I've only shared my story of how it affected me, but it affected my whole family. It affected really thousands of people. And I can't even tell you all the different things that have come out of it. So God has used it here and now, and he's also using it in eternity, which is amazing. But I think that that doesn't take away the pain or the grief of not having the person with you. So I would say I still feel it's really, really painful that he doesn't know Stevie, that he doesn't get to be an uncle to my kids. And I wish that he was here to chat to, and I really still miss him.

53:14 · Speaker 2 And that doesn't go away. But that feels, in the light of that scripture, like a moment. It's a momentary. This is a moment. And we will spend eternity with him. And he will know Stevie. And he'll have all the time in the world to chat with him. And my prayer is, by God's grace, he'll know my children there as well.

53:36 · Speaker 2 So we really have that to hold on to. And yeah, I don't know. I don't want to take up too much time.

53:43 · Speaker 1 No, it's okay. Talk us through. Then I suppose the last question I had for you, I asked Neil and Sharon last week, things that they would want other people to take away from their story. So I'll ask the same sort of question to you. A couple of things that you would want people to take away, if you had control over that.

54:01 · Speaker 2 Yeah, well, I was raised in a Presbyterian background, so I had my three points. I had written my three points down. But there's no alliteration.

54:12 · Speaker 1 You've slept over time. You've slept over time.

54:16 · Speaker 2 But I think the first thing for me is just the bigness of God and the intricacy of his plans and his mind. We've been studying Psalm 139 in the Women's Bible Study, and this week we were talking about the verses, how precious to me are your thoughts, O God, how vast is the sum of them. But to think about that in my life, it's not often that you get to see such a step-by-step, kind of a thing happening where you can really say, because this happened, because he sent me this, because then they got to know these people, because then they met these people, whatever, then that brought me here. So that's amazing because we don't often get that privilege. But then it's also the way that he was working, God was working this whole kind of abstract world around us, like all these things happening simultaneously that he can work in each one of us intimately and with such intricacy and hold it all in his mind at one time to bring so many things together. I can't even fathom the richness of his thoughts. So I think that's the first thing. Then the second thing is that, so he's such a big God, but he's also such an intimate and caring heavenly father.

55:32 · Speaker 2 And he really does delight in giving us good things. And it's not like a health and wealth thing like we work to earn them. We don't deserve them and we don't earn them and we can't, but he just delights in giving good things to us. Um, so like he delighted in bringing me here just so that I could get married and have children and have this lovely little life here, which I think then kind of leads into the third thing that stands out for me, which is that God works these big plans sometimes for really ordinary purposes or what feel ordinary because like I'm not a huge missionary or world changer or whatever. Like he didn't bring me over here to move heaven and earth. He brought me over here for as far as I can see so far, just to like be here and get married, have kids, all ordinary stuff, but it's not ordinary in his kingdom, obviously, or he wouldn't have worked such extravagant plans to make it happen. So for me, that really elevates all of those little ordinary moments.

56:44 · Speaker 2 Um, you know, when you're just like frustrated with your kids or it's just another day or whatever, all those moments have a holiness to them for me because I feel like God obviously really, really, really wanted me to be here. And I still don't know why. I don't know. The story's not done.

57:01 · Speaker 1 The story's not done.

57:02 · Speaker 2 Yeah.

57:03 · Speaker 1 And that's a good place to end it for now. So good to hear your story, for you to share it so openly and honestly with us, to share it so thoughtfully with us as well. I've certainly appreciate it. And I've heard it already, but I heard it in a new way this morning. So we're going to sing Speak O Lord, obviously. And I remember when we were talking, you were saying about how it was, you remembered, you recorded this during lockdown for some of the songs we recorded. And it almost felt like that, almost felt like a full circle thing. Yeah, a really weird moment to kind

57:39 · Speaker 2 of step outside, like the camera zooms outside of you and you're watching from above and you're like, what has God done that I am here at Glen Abbey recording this song, you know, with my husband and for this church that raised the woman who wrote the song. It's just so, yeah, so mental.

57:58 · Speaker 1 And I suppose as we sing it together, it's verse three, I think that is really the one that, do you want to say anything about that? Yeah, just,

58:06 · Speaker 2 you know, I've already said how verse one and two really, I think, I think of that as like my brother's verses. And then verse three is like this verse, I mean all of these are verses these are all verses for all of us but verse 3 really I think sums everything up or ties everything together just this idea, help us grasp the heights of your plans for us, truths unchanged from the dawn of time that will echo down through eternity I just think that's a really beautiful kind of, I couldn't say it I mean I couldn't say it any better than that

58:37 · Speaker 1 that's why they're the hymn writers yeah listen thank you, let's show our appreciation to Corrie And let me just pray, and then we'll sing this together to close. Father, we thank you for, yes, for your love, for your grace in our lives, how Joe's story is such a testimony to that, how Corey's story is such a testimony to that. And we thank you for how you use our stories. We think of how Joe's story is being told in this church this morning, and encouraging so many people in the struggles and in the circumstances that they are in. We pray that by your spirit you will bring comfort through these stories that we're telling and that you will build your kingdom too through the testimony of your followers as their lives point to the truth of your word, to the hope of the gospel, to the hope of eternity with Christ. And we thank you for all this in his name. Amen.